'Meet the Press' transcript for Nov. 8, 2009

GREGORY:  What about your concerns about backlash against our Muslim soldiers who are in the Army, as a result of this incident?

GEN. CASEY:  Yeah.  I think those concerns are real and I, and I will tell you, David, that they're, they're fueled partially, at least, by the speculation about--based on anecdotal evidence that people are presenting.  I think we have to be very careful with that.  Our diversity not only in our Army, but in our country, is a strength.  And as horrific as this tragedy was, if our diversity becomes a casualty, I think that's worse.

GREGORY:  Do you have any reason to believe that having Muslims in the Army puts them in a very difficult position and makes the more conflicted fighting a war against Muslims in Afghanistan or Iraq?

GEN. CASEY:  I think that's something that they have to look at on an individual basis.  But I think we as an Army have to be broad enough to bring in people from all walks of life.

GREGORY:  Before you go this morning, there are reports about the president narrowing down a choice, about 34,000 additional troops for Afghanistan.  Can you say if he's moving in that direction?

GEN. CASEY:  I, I can't.  Those--we'll have some discussions with him I think over the course of the next weeks, and he'll make his decision, and then I'll give him my best professional advice.

GREGORY:  Are you a proponent of additional forces?

GEN. CASEY:  I, I believe that we need to put additional forces into Afghanistan to give General McChrystal the ability to both dampen the successes of the Taliban while we train the Afghan security forces.

GREGORY:  And the 40,000 you think is appropriate, that level?

GEN. CASEY:  I'm not going to comment on any specific number.

GREGORY:  All right.  General, again, our thoughts and prayers with the fallen and their families...

GEN. CASEY:  Thank you very much, David.  I appreciate it.

GREGORY:  ...at Fort Hood.  Thank you very much for being here.

Want to turn now to another big story, and that is the sweeping healthcare bill that has passed the House of Representatives.  It passed late last night by a vote of 220-215, with 39 Democrats voting against the measure and one Republican voting for it.

(Videotape)

REP. PELOSI:  The bill is passed.

(End videotape)

GREGORY:  That victory represents a hard-fought victory for the president, who made a personal appeal to House Democrats at the Capitol yesterday afternoon.

We are joined here now by two governors on the front lines of this political debate, Republican governor of Mississippi and the chair of the Republican Governors' Association, Haley Barbour; and Democratic Governor of Pennsylvania, former chairman of the Democratic National Committee, Ed Rendell.

Welcome, both of you, back to MEET THE PRESS.

GOV. ED RENDELL (D-PA):  David.

GOV. HALEY BARBOUR (R-MS):  (Unintelligible)

GREGORY:  Good to have you here.  Let's talk about this news.  Governor Barbour, I'll start with you.  The House has passed healthcare reform.  Is the president over the hump on this now?  Will he get overall, sweeping reform?

GOV. BARBOUR:  Oh, I doubt it.  I think that the closeness of the vote in the House, the fact that the leadership had to break arms and still lost almost 40 Democrats argues what real trouble they're going to have in the Senate.

GREGORY:  Governor Rendell, to that point, one Republican.  It can't make the White House very happy this morning that they don't have much of a centrist coalition on which to build healthcare reform.

GOV. RENDELL:  Sure, it can't, but I think that's something we've just got to look beyond.  This country needs healthcare reform.  Everybody agrees on that. The things that are agreed upon by Republicans and Democrats, 80 percent of the bill, we're going to get those in a healthcare bill that's going to pass the Senate, it's going to--it's passed the House already.  The conference committee will iron out some of the problems and it'll be a huge step forward for Americans.

GREGORY:  What...

GOV. RENDELL:  Not just Americans who don't have health care, David, but Americans who do have it and are worried that if they change jobs and they have a pre-existing illness they won't be able to get health care.

GREGORY:  But look at the Senate.  You had said this week, talking about it after the election this Tuesday, it's going to be harder to be a conservative, moderate Democrats, the so-called Blue Dogs, to support something that's broad and visionary.  We see--we've seen what's happened in the House.  On the Senate side, there's more conservative Democrats.  Are they going to feel like this is a safe vote cast in favor of healthcare reform?

GOV. RENDELL:  Yeah.  I think if you look at the polls--I saw an interesting poll in Arkansas.  The public option is supported 57 to 23 by the citizens of Arkansas.  Now, I know Senator Lincoln has a tough vote to weigh.  I think there'll be a compromise on public option, maybe a phase-in or a trigger, or maybe the opt-in or opt-out.  But I think we're going to get basic health care, because we need it.  There are people all over this country who have health care, who are afraid they're going to lose it.

GREGORY:  Governor Barbour, is it a problem politically for Republicans to be the party of no on this legislation, given what's happened now in the House? Is there a danger that Republicans aren't getting on board with something that could be more popular down the road?

GOV. BARBOUR:  Well, I think first of all, most people in America don't want this, so to be the people that defeat it will be popular.  But Ed said something very important.  Sixty, 80 percent of the things that we talk about in health care could've passed the House last night 400 to 20.  But instead the Democrat leadership chose not to stop there, but to try to cram down the country's throat a government-run healthcare system that GAO--I mean, CBO, the Congressional Budget Office, says is going to drive up health insurance premiums.  The American people thought the idea here was we were trying to get control of the costs.  Five hundred billion dollar cuts in Medicare.  States like Mississippi and Pennsylvania are going to be forced to raise our taxes, because part of the cost of this is being dumped on us.  There are lots of things in here that most Americans don't want, I don't believe the Senate will pass.  But yeah, we could have a very good healthcare reform bill that would pass overwhelmingly, but about 10 things in here wouldn't be included.

GREGORY:  Governor Rendell, if you talk in terms of what health care means--if premiums do go up, if the middle class does feel a tax hike with a, an individual mandate, you've got to buy insurance if that's held up--is this going to be healthcare reform that delivers to--for the middle class?

GOV. RENDELL:  Sure it is.  David, look, most people in the middle class do have health care and the mandate's not going to affect them.  Small businesses are exempted from any of the mandates on business itself.  Look, there's no perfect bill out there, but this bill is what we need.  The problem with what Haley says is, yes, we could pass a healthcare bill that 80 percent--we agree on 80 percent of the things, but it wouldn't increase access for Americans, it wouldn't solve some of the basic problems of health security.  That has to be done in this country and it has to be done now, and people understand that. Is--are there ways to do it that limit the things that Haley talks about? Absolutely.  I'd like to see more cost controls in the bill.  We've cut costs in Pennsylvania, Mississippi's cut costs, states have cut costs.  We can do this, but we've got to pass a bill.

GREGORY:  All right, let me talk about the political landscape here that is affected by health care, is affected by the jobs numbers, which we'll get to in just a moment.  First of all, what happened this week, different views among Democrats, and we'll play some of them.  This is the House Speaker Nancy Pelosi.

(Videotape, Wednesday)

REP. PELOSI:  From my perspective, we won last night.

(End videotape)

GREGORY:  Senator Mark Warner had a different view.  "We got walloped," he said.  How about former Senator Bob Kerrey?  He said, "Every Democrat who is up in either 2010 or 2012 knows that last night was big.  ...  The electorate appears restless and angry." And Tennessee Democrat Congressman Jim Cooper said it's "a wake-up call for Congress.  A tidal wave could be coming." Governor Barbour, is this a revival for the GOP?

GOV. BARBOUR:  Well, it was a great night for Republicans.  I think we should've go on and say what David Broder said in The Washington Post, that the research showed the polling--the more people were concerned about losing their job or trying to find a job, the more heavily they voted Republican; even more than independents, who voted 2-to-1 for the Republicans, people who had jobs and the economy on their mind.  And that's what the American people want.  You see Democratic congressmen like the--Jim Cooper from Tennessee, Michael Michaud from up in, up in Maine.  The American people want Congress focused on jobs; instead, they see Congress focused on a healthcare reform bill that's going to drive up taxes for small businesses, the biggest employers in the country.  NFIB, the spokesman for small business, say it'll cost $1.6 million jobs.  No wonder people are mad that they're out here passing a healthcare reform bill like this when what the public want is job creation.  Bob McDonnell won in Virginia because he talked about jobs, economic growth, taxes and spending.

GREGORY:  If this wasn't, as the White House claimed--they said it was not a referendum on President Obama, it does say something about the mood in the country, Governor.

GOV. RENDELL:  Well, there's no question, there's an anti-incumbent mood in the country.  I'm happy I wasn't running this year, I don't know about Haley. But it's an anti-incumbent, and that's natural.  When things are bad, incumbents are held responsible for them.  But it wasn't about President Obama.  Look at the Virginia exit poll, David; 24 percent said they came out to vote against President Obama, 20 percent said they came out to vote for him, but 60 percent, almost 60 percent said they voted on state issues. Governors? elections are about leadership.  That's how people make their decisions.  Congressional elections reflect more what's going on in Washington.  And the one big one, the one mega one, Democrats won a seat that they haven't held in 100 years.  So I'm not sure you can draw any conclusions, but I am sure of one thing:  a year in politics is light years, is light years.

GREGORY:  And, and, and when we talk about coalitions or the, the mood of voters, that can change.  But for the moment those independent voters, which were so important for President Obama, to the Democrats, are saying something pretty loudly.  This was The Washington Times reporting on the results on Wednesday:  "Independents fuel GOP victories." Look at our own polling and look at how the independent sentiment has changed for President Obama.  Back in March he had approval of 58 percent, now it's 41; disapproval up to 52 percent.  And Politico reported something that was interesting on Thursday about, again, the sentiment of independents:  "Many Democratic politicians and operatives publicly and privately say Obama's `big bang' strategy--trying to move several major policy initiatives in his first year--has also caused independent voters to question whether he is sufficiently focused on their primary concern, reviving the stagnant economy." Is he going too fast when you've got 10.2 percent unemployment?

GOV. RENDELL:  Well, it's interesting; even in Virginia, where we lost the election big, his favorable rating was 57 percent.  At the same time...

GREGORY:  But it's a different question of whether he's taking on too much.

GOV. RENDELL:  Is he taking on too much?  He's taken on too much, David, because there are crises.  He inherited these crises.  He didn't go looking to take on these problems.

GREGORY:  But you think he should slow down.

GOV. RENDELL:  No.  I...

GREGORY:  You said that.

GOV. RENDELL:  I think we should focus on the economy.

GREGORY:  Right.

GOV. RENDELL:  And we can focus on the economy.  I think the stimulus is working.  It's working in Pennsylvania, it's working in many states around the country.  I think we ought to up front transportation spending, because infrastructure has the biggest return and that's a Republican and Democrat issue that we agree on.

GREGORY:  Right.

GOV. RENDELL:  Infrastructure produces construction jobs.

GREGORY:  You've got 7,000 new jobs in Pennsylvania because of the stimulus. Is that enough?

GOV. RENDELL:  And, and, and plenty of retained jobs that we would've lost. We have $2.6 billion of federal money in our budget.  Without that money, teachers, policemen, municipal workers, county workers all would've lost their jobs.

GREGORY:  But if you say focus on the economy, does that mean you think he should avoid taking on some other issues?

GOV. RENDELL:  I think we should emphasize infrastructure through a speeded up transportation bill.  Infrastructure produces construction jobs, manufacturing jobs.  That's exactly what this country needs.  I think the president's thinking about that.

GREGORY:  Governor Barbour:

GOV. BARBOUR:  David, we shouldn't confuse the president being personally unpopular.  Americans want our presidents to succeed; and particularly the first time we ever elect an African-American president, I think there's great sentiment in favor of him.  It's his policies that are unpopular.  His policies about energy policy is very unpopular.  His policy about healthcare policy is very unpopular.  People think Washington's spending money could give drunken sailors a bad name.  I mean, what they're seeing here is you can't spend yourself rich.  Americans know that.  But the government keeps spending and spending and spending.  And instead of focusing on jobs, like Congressman Gerry Connolly from--new Democrat from Virginia said, they see focus on health care, focus on energy.

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