'Meet the Press' transcript for June 14, 2009

MR. DAVID GREGORY:  This Sunday, Joe Biden is back exclusively on MEET THE PRESS, his first appearance as vice president.  Our issues:  the pressing agenda at home and abroad.  Is the economic stimulus plan living up to the administration's lofty promises?  Can the president get health reform this year?  And how can the country afford it?  Plus, a dangerous foreign landscape; wars in Iraq and Afghanistan, new threats from North Korea and all eyes on the election in Iran.  What will the vote mean for America's national security?

Also with us this morning, two reform-minded Republicans.  Republican strategist and John McCain's chief strategist during the 2000 presidential campaign, Mike Murphy; and former Congressman Joe Scarborough, host of MSNBC's "Morning Joe" and the author of the new book "The Last Best Hope."

But first, Vice President Joe Biden, welcome back to MEET THE PRESS.

VICE PRES. JOE BIDEN:  It's nice to be with you, David.

MR. GREGORY:  It's good to have you here.  There's a lot going on, let's get right to it.  The developing story is Iran.  This has been the scene over the weekend in Tehran, street protests turning violent at times, those protesting the fact that Ahmadinejad is still in power, has claimed victory in this presidential race.  He spoke to the press this morning, indicating that this was a free and fair election and also was rather belligerent, saying anybody who would attack Iran would come to deeply regret it.  Is Mahmoud Ahmadinejad the winner of this election, as you see it?

VICE PRES. BIDEN:  Well, you know, we don't have all the details.  It sure looks like the way they're suppressing speech, the way they're suppressing crowds, the way in which people are being treated that there's some real doubt about that.  I don't think we're in a position to say.  It was surprising that the assertion was he won by what, 60-some percent of the vote?  And so I think we have to wait and see.  But it, it, it didn't seem on its face to be as clear cut as so many...(unintelligible).

MR. GREGORY:  Well, what specifically is the administration doing to find out what you need to find out?

VICE PRES. BIDEN:  Well, we're, we're doing what every other country is doing.  We're doing everything we can in our power with folks that are on the ground, with the press that's left.  I know it's being kicked out.  Actually going back and taking a look--for example, 70 percent of the vote comes out of the city.  That's not Ahmadinejad's strong place.  The idea he could get, you know, 68 or whatever percent of the vote...

MR. GREGORY:  Right.

VICE PRES. BIDEN:  ...and, and in a circumstance like that seems unlikely.

MR. GREGORY:  He says it's free and fair.  You sound like you have doubts.

VICE PRES. BIDEN:  Well, you know, I, I have doubts, but I--we're going to withhold comment until we have a, you know, a thorough review of the whole process and how they react in the aftermath.

MR. GREGORY:  A couple of years ago you said the following about Ahmadinejad when you were on the campaign trail:  "`Ahmadinejad, the madman, is in competition with mullahs and ayatollahs who think he's overstepped his bounds.' ...  Biden called [him] `that wacko guy, the crazy president,' and said he would only be in office for a little more than a year before being `taken out' because he threatened Shia interests." He's proved to be more durable than that, hasn't he?

VICE PRES. BIDEN:  Yes.

MR. GREGORY:  Why?

VICE PRES. BIDEN:  Well, I think because it, it appears as though the supreme leader has decided the alternatives aren't as, aren't as useful.  But again, this is--I'm getting a little head of myself here.  We have to see what the results were, we have to have an analysis of it.  And that'll be being done by not just us...

MR. GREGORY:  Right.

VICE PRES. BIDEN:  ...by every country in the world.  And, and we can make a better judgment  then.

MR. GREGORY:  You don't want to recognize him as the president of Iran at this stage.

VICE PRES. BIDEN:  Well, I, I'm not--look, that's, that's what they're announcing.

MR. GREGORY:  Right.

VICE PRES. BIDEN:  We have to accept that for the time being.  And--but there's an awful lot of question about how this election was run.  And we'll see.  I mean, we're just waiting to see.  We don't have, we don't have enough facts to note--to make a firm judgment.

MR. GREGORY:  Even without those facts, the question is whether the belligerence we're seeing from Ahmadinejad is a sign that he is emboldened, that this regime is emboldened, or is it in some way it weakened?  How do you see it?

VICE PRES. BIDEN:  Well, the question is, is it for domestic consumption or is it for foreign consumption?  It's obvious he has some problems right now. Let's assume he won the election fair and square, he still has some problems at home.  And so it seems as though he--it--you know, it's hard to say where it's directed.  It could just as easily be directed at his domestic critics. And they are, they are real.  They're--and they exist.

MR. GREGORY:  But this administration went out of its way--the president sent a message directly to the Iranian people; the president made this speech in, in Cairo reframing the relationship with the Muslim world, and yet this is the response from the Iranian people.  Or is it?

VICE PRES. BIDEN:  Well, well...

MR. GREGORY:  Do you think Iran is a democracy?

VICE PRES. BIDEN:  No.  That's the question, is this the response, is this the accurate response we're getting?  Is this the result of the Iranian people's wishes?  The hope is that the Iranian people, all their votes have been counted, they've been counted fairly.  But look, we just don't know enough, David.  It's been less than 24 hours since the polls have closed.

MR. GREGORY:  Who runs Iran's nuclear program?

VICE PRES. BIDEN:  Well, look, this is a regime, it's not a single person. The supreme leader is, by all accounts, the supreme leader.  And so I doubt whether there's anything that can be done without--of consequence, without the supreme leader's sanctioning.

MR. GREGORY:  If these results are borne out, if Ahmadinejad remains in power, this administration has said it's willing to engage with Iran.  How do you go about doing that?

VICE PRES. BIDEN:  Look, talks with Iran are not a reward for good behavior. They're only a consequence if the president makes the judgment it's in the best interest of the United States of America, our national security interests, to talk with the Iranian regime.  Our interests are the same before the election as after the election, and that is we want them to cease and desist from seeking a nuclear weapon and having one in its possession, and secondly to stop supporting terror.  That's why we've joined with the so-called P5 plus 1.  We've laid out to the Iranian regime what it is that we, the P5 plus 1, are prepared to talk about.  And, and look, we--if there are talks, we are, you know, it's something that is going to be done with the regime.  It's not being done with a single person.

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