'Meet the Press' transcript for Oct. 12, 2008

MR. BROKAW:  Before we, if we, if we can, I think across this country right now folks are gathered around the kitchen table trying to determine what they're going to do in the next year--where they're going to have to cut, where they can save money.

GOV. CORZINE:  Right.

MR. BROKAW:  We know that's going on in Main Street.  Small independent banks are figuring out who they can loan money to safely.  States, cities, everyone is trying to develop a set of priorities.  Here's what happened the other night at the debate when I asked the two candidates about their priorities. Let's listen to that for a moment.

(Videotape, Tuesday)

MR. BROKAW:  Health care, energy, and entitlement reform--Social Security and Medicare--in what order would you put them in terms of priorities?

SEN. JOHN McCAIN (R-AZ):  I, I think you can work on all three at once, Tom.

SEN. BARACK OBAMA (D-IL):  We're going to have to prioritize, just like a family has to prioritize.  Now, I've listed the things that I think have to be at the top of the list.  Energy we have to deal with today.  Health care is priority number two, because that broken health care system is bad not only for families, but it's making our businesses less competitive.  And number three, we've got to deal with education.

(End videotape)

MR. BROKAW:  That response--or nonresponse, depending on your point of view--brought this from the dean of political columnists in Washington, David Broder:  "John McCain and Barack Obama have been asked twice--once in the Mississippi debate and again on Tuesday night--what their priorities would be. McCain flat-out refused to choose, arguing that the United States can do it all.  Obama mentioned energy, health care and education but did not acknowledge that he might have to choose among them.  ...  It was a stunning rejection of reality," according to David Broder.

Don't you think the American public wants more candor and is prepared to hear someone say, "Look, there's going to be no gain unless we go through some pain," Congressman?

FMR. REP. PORTMAN:  Well, first of all, John McCain was answering a question which was about health care and energy and entitlements, and absolutely we need to move forward on all three of those.  He...

MR. BROKAW:  At once?

FMR. REP. PORTMAN:  Well, of course.  I mean, and, and you can.  He's talked about the, the commission which--Blue Ribbon Commission, which is necessary to deal with the Medicare problem.  He talked about that later.  Of course we need to move forward aggressively on energy independence, including starting to drill right now.  Of course we need to move forward on being sure that the health care costs are contained.  What he did not say in response to that answer, because you didn't ask him, was that he believes we do need to make choices.  And he said it later in the debate when he talked about a spending freeze.  This is a tough approach.  Again, having been in the position of looking at this budget, John McCain is saying let's put everything under the microscope and, and not do it with a scalpel, but do it with a hatchet, a scalpel and, in some cases, you need to eliminate programs altogether.  And so he is--you know, he is giving people straight talk on that.  This is tough medicine.  We haven't done that in the Bush administration, we didn't do it in the Clinton administration.  It's time to tighten our belt at the federal government level just as you said homeowners are doing it, families are doing it all around America.

MR. BROKAW:  Governor Corzine.

GOV. CORZINE:  States are doing it, I assure you we have.

FMR. REP. PORTMAN:  And states are doing.

GOV. CORZINE:  We actually cut our budget...

FMR. REP. PORTMAN:  Because they have a balanced budget requirement.

GOV. CORZINE:  Yeah, we have a requirement.

Senator Obama's been very clear...

FMR. REP. PORTMAN:  But that's what we should do at the federal level.

GOV. CORZINE:  ...about that you may have to slow down some of the things that you want to bring in.  I heard that in the, the debate before you ask the question, and that's, that's realistic.  We may not be able to do everything we want to do on education as fast as we want to do.  But the first two that Senator Obama talked about, on energy and health care, if we don't fix those, our problems and imbalances in this economy get worse.  We want to create jobs right now.  Greening jobs, converting into alternative energies and conservation, are actually going to create jobs which actually increase revenues if we have more people working.

Health care, we have a universal health care system right now.  It's in our emergency rooms.  People go there, they get care, and we, at the state level, have to pay it through reimbursement for the, the charity care that we all have.  That can't keep going on.  It's broken.  And so we have to deal with that now.  Senator Obama has a much better, on almost every evaluative merit basis, health care system that will get people fully insured over the next--we can't stop on that.  Otherwise, we're going to end up going broke in different places.  We're just changing who's, who's going broke.

FMR. REP. PORTMAN:  Tom...

MR. BROKAW:  Isn't there going to be a new reality about health care in the next year or so?  Because as corporations look to cut back, the primary cost that they have outside of doing business is in health care.  So isn't that monster...

FMR. REP. PORTMAN:  Absolutely.

MR. BROKAW:  ...going to grow even more, Congressman Portman?

FMR. REP. PORTMAN:  Yeah, absolutely.  Yeah.

MR. BROKAW:  And you're probably going to have to retool your plan as well.

FMR. REP. PORTMAN:  Well, the McCain plan is very targeted toward reducing the costs of the health care system--the cost to families, the cost to companies, the cost to our economy--and the Obama plan is not.  With all due respect, they are very different plans.  But the independent evaluations that I've seen, including one last week, shows that the McCain plan will cover about the same number of uninsured--in fact, this particular analysis said a few million more people--but it will reduce costs.  That's the key.  If you just turn a government plan into the, the Obama approach, which is to say, `We're going to have more government involvement,' you're not going to get at the cost issue.  And what the McCain plan does is it creates competition that will reduce costs, as well as providing $5,000 track--tax credit to everybody who has health care, including those who have employer coverage, and to folks who're uninsured, to cover more people.  So if you're going to get at the economic issue in health care, which is the, which is the increased cost, the McCain plan actually works better.

MR. BROKAW:  I have a feeling...

GOV. CORZINE:  It will, it will give a $5,000 tax credit.  But for a family of four, most health insurance policies are about $12,000 a year.  The second thing is...

FMR. REP. PORTMAN:  It's $5800.

GOV. CORZINE:  ...it's going to put, it's going to put taxes on the health care benefits that people receive from the corporations.  Every estimate I've seen is 20 million people would be uninsured under the McCain plan.  What we are doing in the Obama proposal is building on what is working in the system, making sure that children's health insurance is provided to every child.  Then using the systems that we already have, the private health care system, to build on it to get everybody insured.  And if there's fallout, then offer the same thing that you and I have, when you were a congressman and I was a senator, available to the people that are left out of the system.  I think that works.  I think it is affordable, and it is unaffordable to continue doing what we're doing now because what we're doing is going into the emergency room.  It's costing a fortune.  It's the worst health care in the world.

MR. BROKAW:  Let me, let me recommend that our viewers go to the respective Web sites of these two campaigns...

FMR. REP. PORTMAN:  Yeah.

MR. BROKAW:  ...to get a real picture of what their health care plans are.

GOV. CORZINE:  Sure.

MR. BROKAW:  Can we turn now to the tone of the campaign, which has gotten a lot of attention in the last 48 hours or so?  There was an exchange, very spirited exchange in Minnesota over the weekend.  We want to share, first of all, one of the ads that Senator McCain has been adding, which might have created--helped create a climate that existed in Minnesota.  So let's take a look at the ad first, and then what was going on when the senator had a town hall meeting.

(Videotape from political ad)

Narrator:  Obama's blind ambition.  When convenient, he worked with terrorist Bill Ayers.  When discovered, he lied.  Obama:  blind ambition, bad judgment.

(End videotape)

(Videotape, Friday, town hall meeting):

Unidentified Man:  We're scared.  We're scared of an Obama presidency.  And I'll, I'll tell you why.  I'm concerned about, you know, someone that cohorts with domestic terrorists such as Ayers.

SEN. McCAIN:  Thank you.  First of all, I want to be president of the United States, and obviously, I do not want Senator Obama to be.  But I have to tell you, I have to tell you he is a decent person and a person that you do not have to be scared as president of the United States.  Now, I just, now I just, now, now look.  I, I--if I didn't think I wouldn't be one heck of a lot better president, I wouldn't be running, OK?

Unidentified Woman:  I've got to ask you a question.  I do not believe in--I can't trust Obama.

SEN. McCAIN:  I got it.

Woman:  I, I have read about him, and he's not, he's not, he's a--he's an Arab.  He is not...

SEN. McCAIN:  No, ma'am.

Woman:  No?

SEN. McCAIN:  No, ma'am.  No, ma'am.  No, ma'am.  He's a, he's a decent family man, citizen, that I just happen to have disagreements with on, on fundamental issues and that's what this campaign is all about.  He's not. Thank you.

(End videotape)

MR. BROKAW:  And the reaction of Senator Obama to the defense that he received from Senator McCain was this in Philadelphia on Saturday:

(Videotape)

SEN. OBAMA:  I want to acknowledge that Senator McCain tried to tone down the rhetoric in his town hall meeting yesterday.  I appreciated his reminder that we can disagree while still being respectful of each other.

(End videotape)

MR. BROKAW:  Congressman Portman, has this gone too far in terms of the attacks on Senator Obama and his association with Bill Ayers in Chicago? Governor Palin has gone so far as to say he's palling around with a terrorist. Is that a really fair characterization in your judgment?

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