‘Meet the Press’ transcript for Dec. 23, 2007

MR. RUSSERT:  The very latest from Iowa and New Hampshire.  Our political roundtable--John Harwood, Chuck Todd--after this station break.

(Announcements)

MR. RUSSERT:  And we're back.

Welcome, both.  Let's go right to the polling numbers.  This is the latest NBC News/Wall Street Journal poll.  The national numbers, look at that.  Rudy Giuliani is now at 20, down 13 points in a month.  Mitt Romney's up 9, Huckabee up 9, and McCain down 2, Thompson down 4.

Giuliani, what caused the decline?  Look at this.  In March he had a 58-to-14 positive/negative.  It's now 37/37 after an avalanche of stories about Bernard Kerik, his former police commissioner, about New York security guards and who they protected at taxpayers' money, about Rudy Giuliani's business interest, and it's taken a toll.

But let's go to the states, because this is what really counts.  Here's Iowa. Huckabee is ahead in both polls, 33 to 25 over Romney, 35 to 27 in other, the rest of the lineup there.

Let's go to New Hampshire, some new numbers out today.  The Boston Globe: Romney, 28; McCain, 25; Giuliani, 14; Huckabee, 10; and Paul, 8.  Three points between McCain and Romney.  An earlier poll had it a 7 point race.  And in South Carolina, Huckabee, 28; Romney, 20; Giuliani, 12; McCain, 11; Thompson, 10.  Chuck Todd, what does it all tell you?

MR. CHUCK TODD:  Well, there's no Republican front-runner, and until we find out how badly Mitt Romney wins--loses Iowa, and I think that that's the assumption they're under at this point, that, that they're...

MR. JOHN HARWOOD:  You called it already?

MR. TODD:  They know that--they're worried they're going to lose Iowa, but they're trying to close the gap.  They're trying to close this gap so that they look like they at least have a running start to salvage New Hampshire. Because their bigger fear right now, the Romney people are absolutely petrified of John McCain.  He is on the rise.

MR. RUSSERT:  So if Mitt Romney lost Iowa, a weakened Romney goes to New Hampshire, and if he's beaten there by John McCain?

MR. TODD:  It's done.  He's done.

MR. HARWOOD:  He's done if he loses both of those.  What they're hoping, as Chuck said, is that they either win--and I wouldn't, given how unpredictable this race is, I wouldn't rule out...

MR. TODD:  Fair enough.

MR. HARWOOD:  ...Romney and his organization pulling out a victory, but if he doesn't win, he needs to be strong in New Hampshire.  If he loses both of those back to back to Huckabee and McCain, he's got big problems.

MR. RUSSERT:  A--what Mitt Romney--there're several articles written about his talking about seeing his father marching with Martin Luther King in, in the '60s.  He talked about it in his faith speech, he talked about it here on MEET THE PRESS, and then was forced to do some explaining.  Let's watch what he said earlier this month.

(Videotape, December 8, 2007)

MR. MITT ROMNEY:  I saw my father march with Martin Luther King.

(End videotape)

(Videotape, last Sunday)

MR. ROMNEY:  But you can see what I believed and what my family believed by looking at our, at our lives.  My dad marched with Martin Luther King.

(End videotape)

MR. RUSSERT:  And then on Thursday, he sought to clarify what he really intended to say.  Let's listen.

(Videotape, Thursday)

MR. ROMNEY:  If you look at the literature or look at the dictionary, the term 'saw' includes 'being aware of' in the sense I've described. It's a figure of speech and very familiar, and it's very common. And I saw my Dad march with Martin Luther King. I did not see with my own eyes, but I saw him in the sense of being aware of his participation in the great effort.

(End videotape)

MR. HARWOOD:  Tim, I think, if you look at the way Mitt Romney's run his campaign, there's plenty to criticize.  Those of us old enough to remember "Leave It to Beaver" sometimes see Eddie Haskell in Mitt Romney going to every constituency group and saying, "You look so lovely, Mrs. Cleaver." In this case, though, I think when he's talking about his father, who was on the same side of--with Martin Luther King in the civil rights movement, marched in Grosse Pointe a few days after Martin Luther King marched in Detroit, I think that falls into the range of what our friend Bill McInturff, who does a journal NBC poll calls acceptable political hyperbole.  I don't think it's a big deal.

MR. RUSSERT:  He did say that the New York--New England Patriots won the World Series and corrected himself to say Super Bowl, thank God.  Chuck:

MR. TODD:  I disagree.  I actually think this has turned into a little bit of a big deal.  The blogs are nuts on it, the conservative blogs, because it's not that this is the first time he's done something like this.  The problem is, is that it feeds into this idea that he will say and--say anything it takes to win over a constituency group.  The Eddie Haskell thing, that's a--that, that cracked me up because you do have that feeling.  He will say anything it takes to be liked, and that Martin Luther King thing.  And the fact is, it's been a real distraction.  Before it, you know, midweek last week, he stopped the bleeding in Iowa, he's being, you know, looked like he was finally starting, you know, Huckabee was getting on the defensive, and then he had to spend 48 hours dealing with this story.  Luckily for him, there's so many other things distracting all the political press, but this was one of those things, I don't know if it goes away.  Ask Al Gore what it's like when suddenly every word, it happens to get parsed.  Mitt Romney is not been good when the pressure's been on and the spotlight's been on.  And that's one of those moments.

MR. HARWOOD:  I agree it's become a political problem.  My point is on the substance, when he says "What I meant was, I was aware of it," that doesn't seem to me to be an unreasonable explanation.

MR. TODD:  But they don't even have George Romney ever appearing with Martin Luther King.  I mean, that was the problem is that there are many issues with it.  It may be that his father never even marched with him.

MR. RUSSERT:  But he was a crusader.

MR. TODD:  Absolutely, and nobody wants to take that away from his father.

MR. HARWOOD:  But I will say, Tim, you got to wonder how George Romney would feel about watching Mitt Romney in one of those debates a few days ago, criticizing Rudy Giuliani for saying that New York City was welcoming to illegal immigrants.  Mitt Romney, for the reason that Chuck mentioned, is sort of taken and run with that immigration issue.  George Romney might not like it.

MR. RUSSERT:  And John McCain, he wants Huckabee to win Iowa big, as we said. He also would like to see Hillary Clinton knock off Barack Obama and John Edwards in Iowa and try to lock up the Democratic nomination.  So all those independents in New Hampshire five days later would say, "You know what?  I'm not going to play the Democratic primary, let me go in the Republican primary and find John McCain."

MORE FROM MEET THE PRESS

Meet the Press Section Front

Remembering Tim Russert July 20: Al Gore, political roundtable July 13: Carly Fiorina, Sen. Claire McCaskill (D-MO), politcal roundtable June 29: Gov. Arnold Schwarzenegger (R-CA), Gov. Dave Freudenthal (D-WY), Gov. Bill Ritter (D-CO), Chuck Todd June 22: Sen. Joe Biden (D-DE), Sen. Lindsey Graham (R-SC), political roundtable June 15 transcript, video NBC's Tom Brokaw to moderate 'Meet the Press' through election   Images: The life of the political journalist   Slideshow: A look back at 60 years of 'Meet the Press' Find ‘Meet the Press’ in your area Meet the Press Section Front   Add Meet the Press headlines to your news reader: