Can Edwards break out from the rest?

Chris Matthews Host of 'Hardball' • Profile

On Tuesday's "Hardball with Chris Matthews," Democratic presidential candidate John Edwards talked about the 2008 race and the impact of Iowa on the election.

Below is a transcript.

CHRIS MATTHEWS, HOST, ‘HARDBALL:’  Senator, you were talking about the, let me get the right phrase here, the superficial media coverage of this campaign.

JOHN EDWARDS, DEMOCRATIC PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE:  Hard to believe, isn’t it.

MATTHEWS:  Well, what do you mean by that?

EDWARDS:  Well, I’ll tell you, I think you guys like to cover the glitz.  At least early on, there was a lot of glitz associated with Senator Clinton and Senator Obama.  I think that’s faded some, to be honest with you, and now I think we’re getting down to the nitty-gritty.

MATTHEWS:  Well, we’re looking at you right now.

EDWARDS:  Good!

MATTHEWS:  And I’m looking at...

EDWARDS:  Keep doing it.

MATTHEWS:  Before we get to New Hampshire, you got to get to Iowa on January 3.

EDWARDS:  Yes.

MATTHEWS:  And it does look like a three-way race out there, and it looks very close.  Let me ask you; you almost won last time in Iowa...

EDWARDS:  Yes.

MATTHEWS:  ... because everybody was watching Dick Gephardt, in that case, attack Howard Dean.

EDWARDS:  Yes.

MATTHEWS:  Is that going to happen again, where you have a fight, where Hillary’s people are out attacking Obama, and you go by them on the right or left?

EDWARDS:  I have no idea.  I mean, there’s been some fussing going on between them.  I just got to -- I know what to do in Iowa.  I know how to close there.  People there want to see you speak from your gut.  They want to see passion and energy.  They want it to be real.  And when I talk about doing something about corporate power and how it’s affecting the government, they respond.

MATTHEWS:  You are the third candidate in terms of all the publicity.  That’s true.

EDWARDS:  That’s true.

MATTHEWS:  But you are the strongest ideological candidate, it seems like.  You’ve got a real populist message.

EDWARDS:  Yes.

MATTHEWS:  The others I’m not sure about.

EDWARDS:  Yes.

MATTHEWS:  Why -- give me the John Edwards difference.

EDWARDS:  I’m the guy who’s going to fight for the change we need, not talk about it, not try to maneuver my way through a system that I think is broken.  I’m going to fight for the change.  I’ve been doing it for 54 years of my life.  And I’m the one they can count on to stand up for them.

MATTHEWS:  Do you think Hillary is corrupt?

EDWARDS:  No, I don’t think Hillary is corrupt.

MATTHEWS:  You think she’s part of the corrupt system?

EDWARDS:  I think the system is corrupt and the system doesn’t work.

MATTHEWS:  Is she part of it?

EDWARDS:  Well, she defends it, I mean, but saying she’s part of it is a little tough.  But I think she defends it, and I don’t think we should defend it.

MATTHEWS:  Well,  you’re suggesting that she’s comfortable with a negotiating stance with people who that are always going to take it away from you.

EDWARDS:  We disagree about that.  I mean, I disagree with her and I disagree with Senator Obama about it.  Senator Obama also says, you know, he’s a good guy, but he doesn’t defend the system.  He also says, like I do, the system is broken.  But he says that at the same time that he says he’ll sit at the table with drug companies, oil companies and insurance companies and compromise.  It will never work.  Those people aren’t going to voluntarily give their power away.

MATTHEWS:  How do you walk into Washington and say to the congressmen and senators, who have entrenched power, If you don’t give health care to the average person, I’m taking your health care away from you?  What constitutional tool or weapon do you have to take away their health insurance, the senators?

EDWARDS:  The tool you have is the bully pulpit because think about the position of some congressman who says he’s going to protect his own health care and not give health care to the people he represents.  And then I can go into his congressional district and say, I want you to know what your congressman and as president, using the bully pulpit, I want you to know what your congressman’s doing.  He’s defending his own health care, but he won’t provide health care for you.

MATTHEWS:  Are you going to do that to John Dingell?

EDWARDS:  I’ll do it...

MATTHEWS:  You’re not going to go after these guys!

EDWARDS:  Chris, the Democrats...

MATTHEWS:  They’ll laugh at you.

EDWARDS:  The Democrats are going to vote for it.  We’re talking about the Republicans.  And yes, I’ll stand up.  But let me be really...

MATTHEWS:  But every one of these districts is gerrymandered.  They can’t get beaten.  You know you can’t go into inner cities and knock off some of these guys that have been there forever.

EDWARDS: It’s not true that they all can’t be beaten.  There are a lot of them that can be beaten.  And the second thing I’d say is just to be really clear, the battle, though, is not with politicians.  I think shaking them up a little bit is a good thing.

MATTHEWS:  Well, you’re threatening to take away their health care.

EDWARDS:  True, and I’ll follow through on it.  But the goal here is to get health care for the American people, not to fight with politicians.  And I think when you intensify the pressure on them, you do that. But I want to go back.  The real battle here is with the corporate entrenched interests and insurance companies, oil companies, drug companies. 

The battle is not with politicians.

MATTHEWS:  You know what I hear?  The minute the Democrats get the House back, the Congress back, I mean, the presidency back...

EDWARDS:  Yes.

MATTHEWS:  ... then Washington real estate is going to go through the roof because every one of the insurance companies, every one of the corporations in America, every trade association, everyone is going to start building up to the hilt their Washington offices to take you on or whoever wins.

EDWARDS:  Yes, that may be true.  So be it.  Those people, however much money and power they have today, it is nowhere close to the power that the American people have.  The sovereign power in this country rests with America and the American people.

MATTHEWS:  Harry Truman was tougher than you, wasn’t he?

EDWARDS:  No!

MATTHEWS:  Harry Truman said he’s going to bring health care to the people.  Hillary Clinton says she’s going to bring health care to the people.

EDWARDS:  Yes?

MATTHEWS:  Yes.  What was wrong with them?

EDWARDS:  Well, first of all, they were living in a different environment.  I mean, if you look at what’s happening with health care today, as opposed to what was happening, for example, when Senator Clinton did it, the health care system has gotten much worse.  We’ve got 47 million people without coverage.  The costs are through the roof.  I think we’re in a place where the American people are ripe for this change.  They just need a leader who’ll stand up.

MORE FROM HARDBALL WITH CHRIS MATTHEWS

Hardball with Chris Matthews Section Front

Giuliani on McCain's VP search Matthews: Remembering Tim Russert Matthews: Thinking about Hillary Matthews: Remembering RFK — Forty years later Matthews: Why America is making history tonight Matthews: What will textbooks say about this election? Matthews recalls fond memories of Israel Matthews: Buzzed out Hardblogger: Chris Matthews for senator? Hardball College Tour Hardball with Chris Matthews Section Front   Add Hardball with Chris Matthews headlines to your news reader: