Sen. Larry Craig's interview with Matt Lauer

Senator Larry Craig was under arrest at the Minneapolis International Airport, accused of lewd conduct-- soliciting sex in a public bathroom from a man who turned out to be an undercover police officer. For 25 years, there have been rumors that Craig, a conservative Republican, was a closeted homosexual. Tonight, for the first time, he's telling the story of his arrest -- and laying out his defense.

Matt Lauer: When you-- when you got to the police office in the airport, you were asked to show identification.
Larry Craig: Yeah.
Matt Lauer: And instead of showing a driver's license according to the report, you showed this card first that said you were a U.S. Senator. And you said, quote, "What do you think about that?"
Larry Craig: Well, I pulled the card out, laid it down. And while I was reaching for my driver's license, he said, "Oh, you're a U.S. Senator." And I said, "Yeah. What you think about that?" I did say that.
Matt Lauer: What'd you mean by it? Just, in other words, boy we're in some pickle here? Or this is more than you bargained for or--
Larry Craig: No. I didn't mean it in that way at all. I was at a very frustrated, angry, embarrassed situation at that moment. And the tape I think is very clear about what I said and how I reacted.

The tape he's referring to was recorded in the police interrogation room at the Minneapolis Airport. Sergeant Dave Karsnia, who'd arrested Craig just minutes earlier, took him there for questioning.

(Police audio tape)
Larry Craig: Am I going to have to fight you in court?
Dave karsnia: No. No. I'm not going to go to court unless you want me there.
Larry Craig: Because I don't want to be in court either.
Dave Karsnia: All right. I, I know I can bring you to jail, but that's not my goal here, okay?
Larry Craig: Don't do that. You you--
Dave Karsnia: I'm not going to bring you to jail
Larry Craig: You solicited me.
Dave Karsnia: OK. We're going to get, we're going to get into that.

Larry Craig: Let's go back to the interrogation tape. To me, that's so important. Because that was my frame of mind. That was the truth. He kept trying to drag me into other things that just didn't happen. This was an officer that was more interested in the arrest than he was the facts. And I found out I was caught in a situation that I had never been in my life, Matt.

(Police audio tape)
Dave Karsnia: Do you wish to talk to us at this time?
Larry Craig: I do
Dave Karsnia: OK, I just want to start off with a your side of the story, OK.
Larry Craig: So I go into the bathroom here as I normally do, I'm a commuter too here.
Dave Karsnia: OK.
Larry Craig: I sit down, uh, to go to the bathroom and ah, you said our feet bumped. I believe they did, ah, because I reached down and scooted over and, the next thing I knew, under the bathroom divider comes a card that says police. Now, that's about as far as I can take it, I don't know of anything else. Ah, your foot came toward mine, mine came towards yours, was that natural? I don't know. Did we bump? Yes. I think we did. You said so. I don't disagree with that.

Matt Lauer: So, you don't remember at any time tapping your foot?
Larry Craig: I do not.
Matt Lauer: In this way?
Larry Craig: I do not.
Matt Lauer: But in the interrogation tape, you do talk about is it possible your feet brushed?
Larry Craig: Yes.
Matt Lauer: And--
Larry Craig: And I don't know-- it was possible. But I don't recall that. And he kept leading me into this. And I kept saying no. It's clearly on the tape, Matt.

(Police audio tape)
Dave Karsnia: And when you went in the stalls, then what?
Larry Craig: Sat down.
Dave Karsnia: OK. Did you do anything with your feet?
Larry Craig: Positioned them, I don't know. I don't know at the time. I'm a fairly wide guy.
Dave Karsnia: I understand.
Larry Craig: I had to spread my legs.
Dave Karsnia: OK.
Larry Craig: When I lower my pants so they won't slide.
Dave Karsnia: OK.
Larry Craig: Did I slide them too close to yours? Did I, I looked down once, your foot was close to mine.
Dave Karsnia: Yes.
Larry Craig: Did we bump? Ah, you said so, I don't recall that, but apparently we were close.
Dave Karsnia: Yeah, well your foot did touch mine, on my side of the stall.
Larry Craig: All right.

Matt Lauer: You know that there has to be thousands of people who have heard this story now, senator.
Larry Craig: Sure.
Matt Lauer: They're trying to picture how this-- you know, they're flashing back to every time they've ever sat in a bathroom--
Larry Craig: Oh, I know.
Matt Lauer: --stall. And they're trying to think, "Can that happen? How close are you actually to the guy next to you?" And this is that infamous wide stance, which I think what you actually said is, "I'm a wide guy," is the actual quote you said. But-- and they're thinking, "It's not that easy to touch the guy's foot next to you." And so, how could it have happened?
Larry Craig: Well, as I-- it didn't happen.

And what about his hand? The details are critical. The palm-up gesture, regarded as a coded message for men seeking sex.

(Police audio)
Dave Karsnia: OK. And then with the hand. How many times did you put your hand under the stall?
Larry Craig: I don't recall. I remember reaching down once. There was a piece of toilet paper back behind me and picking it up.

Larry Craig: Something attracted my attention, and I looked down. And as I looked down, I saw a piece of toilet paper on the floor. And it happened to be under my heel … and I don't know if you've seen it before, but I've seen it, somebody walk out of a booth with a piece of toilet paper stuck to their foot. I'd reached down to take it off my shoe, or out from under my shoe. And my hand did go below the divider at that moment in time.

(Police audio tape)
Dave Karsnia: Was your palm down or up when you were doing that?
Larry Craig: I don't recall.
Dave Karsnia: OK. I recall your palm being up. OK.
Larry Craig: All right.
Dave Karsnia: when you pick up a piece of paper off the ground, your palm would be down, when you pick something up.
Larry Craig: Yeah, probably would be. I recall picking the paper up.
Dave Karsnia: And I know it's hard to describe here on tape but actually what I saw was your fingers come underneath the stalls, you're actually touching the bottom of the stall divider.
Larry Craig: I don't recall that.
Dave Karsnia: You don't recall
Larry Craig: I don't believe I did that. I don't.
Dave Karsnia: I saw, I saw.
Larry Craig: I don't do those things.
Dave Karsnia: I saw your left hand and I could see the gold wedding ring when it when it went across. I could see that. On your left hand, I could see that.
Larry Craig: Well, we can dispute that. I'm not going to fight you in court and I, I reached down with my right hand to pick up the paper.

Dave Karsnia: I know you're not going to fight me. But that's not the point … You're sitting here lying to a police officer.

Matt Lauer: To this day, you would say to me at no time did you ever use your left hand and go anywhere near your foot or the stall divider.
Larry Craig: Matt, I would have had to turn almost sideways to reach clear across and around. And I absolutely did not do that.
Matt Lauer: So, again, the fact these motions seem to replicate a well-established sequence of signals for soliciting anonymous sex, it's a coincidence?
Larry Craig: I now know that this cop is-- this officer is a profiler. He said looking into a stall was one of it. And then a hand gesture or a foot tap is another one … Now I know all about profiling. I know what people feel like when they're profiled. When innocent people get caught up in what I was caught in as an innocent person, it's very angering at times.
Matt Lauer: You-- you said on a couple of occasions, senator, that-- that this officer, this undercover officer, was a profiler. You said that he tried to put words in your mouth. Are you saying he's a liar?
Larry Craig: I'm say--
Matt Lauer: That these two stories are different?
Larry Craig: They are very different stories. What I'm saying is if what I said on that tape is the truth, you heard my voice. You heard his voice. You saw how hard he worked to get me to say things that I didn't say because I didn't do it.

A spokesman for the airport police says it is true that behavioral profiling caused the officer to focus on Senator Craig but that he arrested Craig for specific actions that violated the law.

And Senator Craig says that once the interrogation was finished, after he was photographed and fingerprinted, he hurried off to catch his flight to Washington-- and waited for the prosecutor to contact him.

Matt Lauer: Could you have said, "Flight be damned, I will stay and I will fight this right now?"
Larry Craig: And I should've. And I should've, Matt. There's no question. At that moment in time, I should've picked up the phone, called my attorney, called my staff and called my wife and said, "I'm not going to make this flight. I've just been arrested."
Matt Lauer: And the reason they you didn't do all those things was what?
Larry Craig: For a moment in time, I was in a panic. And I'm going, "Oh, crimey. What do I do now?"