‘Meet the Press’ transcript for Oct. 7, 2007

MR. RUSSERT: Please.

SEN. EDWARDS: I—this is going to be an election, Tim, it’s not going to be an auction. You know, we’re not going to determine who can raise the most money and thereby who should be president of the United States. It’s an amazing thing to me that when you do something that you believe is right, same thing I did in 2003 and 2004, that this is the response. What I know is true, I know that when we get to after February 5 and it’s pretty clear who the Democratic nominee for president’s going to be, that there needs to be absolutely clear divisions between me as the Democratic nominee and the Republicans.

And I am completely convinced if I have, and I believe I will, beaten two celebrity candidates who will probably have spent over $200 million during the course of the nomination process, I can certainly beat a Republican who’s carrying George Bush’s baggage. And the way I will do it is not on the basis of money, but on the basis of what America needs, on the basis of principle stand, on the basis of big and bold ideas. I want people to see clear differences between me and them, them being the Republicans in this case. They will be awash in corporate money. You can take that to the bank. I will not.

MR. RUSSERT: Senator John Edwards, as always, we thank you for your views and be safe on the campaign trail.

SEN. EDWARDS: Tim, thank you so much.

MR. RUSSERT: Coming next, the race for the White House through the eyes of David Broder, David Brody, Margaret Carlson and Ted Koppel. And the race for space through the eyes of Jay Barbree, who’s covered Cape Canaveral for 50 years. They are next, right here, only on MEET THE PRESS.

(Announcements)

MR. RUSSERT: David Broder, David Brody, Margaret Carlson, Ted Koppel after this station break.

(Announcements)

MR. RUSSERT: And we’re back, welcome all. Let’s start with the Democrats. Here’s the latest national poll: Hillary Clinton is at 46, Barack Obama 25, 11 for John Edwards. Here’s Iowa, out this morning, Des Moines Register poll: Clinton 29, Edwards 23, Obama 22. And the money primary, it’s called, Hillary Clinton this quarter raised $27 million, Edwards raised $7 million, Obama $20 million. Look at those totals: 62, 30 and 75. Edwards says he has $12 million on hand; Clinton and Obama, we do not know, they will not say. But we estimate about $30 million on hand.

David Broder, after the debate in New Hampshire, you wrote this: “During the [New Hampshire-Dartmouth] debate, [Clinton] rarely came out of a defensive crouch, as if,” as if “determined to protect her favored position. ... When asked what her attitude would be toward an Israeli strike on Iranian nuclear facilities, she refused to answer such a ‘hypothetical’ ... she would not play. Instead, she endorsed the recent Israeli attack on Syria - a safe stand.”

“Her greatest evasiveness occurred on the volatile issue of Social Security. ‘I’m not putting anything on the proverbial table’ - meaning no painful tax increases or benefit cuts. ... That is a position that would be hard to maintain in office, but it offers maximum protection for the campaign.”

“It went on like that through several more topics, until a final question about baseball fandom. ... What if it is the Cubs” and “the Yankees [in the World Series, she was] asked. ‘I guess I’d have to alternate,’ she said, triangulating once again.”

“This dodginess got her through the two hours. Whether it can get her through the next three months is a different question.”  Cubs-Yankees, probably not.

MR. DAVID BRODER: Yeah.

MR. RUSSERT: But as to Social Security, Iran, Iraq, and other things, your take.

MR. BRODER: Well, she’s in an interesting position, because if you believe the national polls, this election’s over. I don’t believe that has anything to do with what’s really going on out there. The voters that you meet are still very undecided about this election, and they are appraising these candidates every day on the basis of what they’re hearing or not hearing. And I believe if Mrs. Clinton sticks to her position of not saying anything about any subject, she would pay a price for that over the time between now and January, when the actual voting begins.

MR. RUSSERT: Ted Koppel, after debate the spinners are out, saying she didn’t get caught, she didn’t make a mistake. The debate moment was hers. And then for days or weeks afterwards were these articles saying, “Yeah, but she wasn’t specific on the questions.” What matters?

MR. TED KOPPEL: She’s playing it safe, and, you know, so far ahead right now, all I keep thinking about is the wonderful administration of President Howard Dean, who in February, right, was still so far ahead that they thought John Kerry was out of the race four years ago. I think David’s right. We’re—it’s much too early, but she, she is clearly the one to beat. Remember that wonderful movie from way back with, with Robert Redford, “The Candidate,” where he feels free, this young man taking on this entrenched California senator, feels free to say anything that’s on his mind and comes roaring up so that he’s within, 6, 7 points, and then his handlers start getting to him. Make sure he’s cautious, right? Got to watch out for those handlers. They can overdo it sometimes.

MR. RUSSERT: Who would have thought, Margaret Carlson, if I asked you who would be the first candidate to invoke September 11^th in a campaign advertising, most people would bet Rudy Giuliani. That’s not the case. Let’s watch.

(Videotape of Clinton political ad)

Voice #1: She stood by ground zero workers who sacrificed their health after so many sacrificed their lives, and kept standing till this administration took action.

(End videotape)

MR. RUSSERT: Hillary Clinton.

MS. MARGARET CARLSON: Well, she’s going right at the heart of what looks like her opponent at the moment, Rudy Giuliani. And Rudy and Senator Clinton are in a dance right now, because the stronger she gets, the stronger he gets. Because Republicans want to unite behind a tough person. But that ad is very much like Hillary. It was very good to get her in a gas mask, but it’s safe, it’s conventional and it’s uninformative, just as she was in the debate. And, yes, she broke the political sound barrier with her 50, breaking 50 percent. But, as David and Ted had said, there’s always Iowa. And Iowa has a very good smugness detector. And if she continues as she is, dodging your questions and others, they’re going to look askance at that, and those polls we just saw in Iowa, and there’s one in which Obama’s actually leading, I think pose trouble for this particular tack that Hillary’s taking.

MR. RUSSERT: David Brody, Margaret mentioned Rudy Giuliani/Hillary Clinton. Mrs. Clinton proposed, Senator Clinton proposed, suggested, perhaps, a $5,000 bond for every baby born in the United States. The Giuliani campaign has now issued this Hillary bond, as you can see, trying to draw once again the contrast between Hillary Clinton and Rudy Giuliani. Giuliani is basically using Hillary Clinton as a stalking horse to secure the Republican nomination.

MR. DAVID BRODY: That’s right. And I was in California with Giuliani about a week, week and a half ago, and this is pretty much what he said to fund raisers, on the trail. I mean, he is talking about Hillary Clinton and nobody else. I mean, it’s invoking the 11^th commandment, as for, as Ronald Reagan would say, you know, thou shalt not speak ill of a fellow Republican. Because if you think about what Giuliani has to do here, he has to say, “Listen, I’m electable against Clinton,” and at the same time, he’s going to need to pick off support from Fred Thompson supporters, from Mitt Romney supporters, to a certain extent, John McCain supporters as well if he’s going to win the nomination. Therefore, no reason to go at these folks in a primary season. He needs to just focus on Clinton alone.

MR. RUSSERT: Let me show you the Republican money primary as it’s being suggested. The third quarter, Giuliani out raising all his opposition. Fred Thompson, his first quarter, showed $9 million. Then, cash on hand, Giuliani, 15; McCain, 3.6; Romney, 9; Thompson, 7. That does not count the $17 million Romney has lent his campaign. Translates into these national polls. Giuliani ahead, 27, 23, 13, 11 in one; 30, 23, 15, 10 in the other.

Iowa, little different story. Romney, 29; Thompson, 18; Mike Huckabee, former governor of Arkansas, at 12; Giuliani is fourth at 11, John McCain is 7. David?

MR. BRODER: Well, as you know, I’m a Huckabee fan, so I’m very pleased to see him showing in Iowa. But the interesting thing to me about the Giuliani campaign and what David was saying about his focus on Mrs. Clinton is, if you project that kind of a, of a general election, what’s the reason to think that Giuliani would be the strongest Republican candidate against Mrs. Clinton? Both of them come from an urban base, his, his base overlaps heavily with hers. Wouldn’t they be better off with somebody who has a very different kind of a base?

MR. BRODY: Yeah, that’s a good point. I would say that what he’s going to say on the campaign trail is he is the 50-state candidate. He believes that he can put states in play that Fred Thompson, Mitt Romney and others cannot.

MR. RUSSERT: Giuliani, in fact, his campaign, David, issued a memo saying “The mayor puts blue states like Connecticut, New Jersey, Wisconsin, California, Oregon, Pennsylvania and Washington” state “in play,” that he secures all the states that John Kerry and Al Gore could not win; plus, he puts all these other sates in play, ironically suggesting he does that because he’s more moderate on social and cultural issues, which flies in the face of his campaign to secure conservative voters.

MR. BRODER: Exactly. I mean, he’s delivering so many different messages, it seems to me. Looking past this primary to a hypothetical general election, I really wonder if that argument’s going to hold up under the scrutiny of the next three months.

MR. RUSSERT: But that’s the wonderful thing about American politics, Ted Koppel. Mitt Romney has purchased 10,000 television ads. Rudy Giuliani, zero. What he does is, Giuliani has direct mail and niche radio, talking to conservatives saying, “You know, I’m not all that bad.” But to a general audience, he can’t go on and stake out conservative positions because it might cloud his more moderate image, which he’s also trying to hold on to.

Here’s an example. When he was mayor of New York, he used to have these radio interview shows live from city hall. Here he is about the National Rifle Association.

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