MTP Transcript for April 22, 2007

MS. GOODWIN: And he refused to fire these people who he should have fired, so he kept them on until finally they had to be forced resignation, and people said it was water torture. There was even one guy who was an ambassador to Mexico who had admitted in a congressional hearing under the Kefauver, that he’d actually put gangsters into his New York Cabinet—he was the mayor—and he wouldn’t resign, he refused to resign. And Harry Truman said, “He’s a fighter, I’m going to support him.” Well, you know, after awhile, that undid Harry Truman. So I think President Bush, who loves Harry Truman, loves loyalty, has to realize that sometimes loyalty to the country is more important than loyalty to your friend, if it turns out that the time for Gonzales is to go.

MR. RUSSERT: It’s hard for a president when someone comes from their home state.

MS. GOODWIN: Oh, it’s terribly hard. But I mean, that’s where, as president, you sometimes have to undo your friendships. And, and what you have to hope for is that Mr. Gonzales—if this thing continues to unwind—realizes it’s his responsibility to give President Bush that chance.

MR. RUSSERT: A Democrat got in some hot water with, with his fellow party members as well. Harry Reid, the leader of the Democrats, talked about the war in Iraq and the funding, and this is what he had to say.

(Videotape, April 19, 2007)

SEN. MAJ. LEADER HARRY REID (D-NV): I believe, myself, that the secretary of state, secretary of defense—and you have to make your own decision as to what the president knows—that this war is lost.

(End of videotape)

MR. RUSSERT: Several Democrats called me, Jon Meacham, and said, “We don’t want—we do not, do not want to be debating whether the, the war is lost or not.”

MR. MEACHAM: Right.

MR. RUSSERT: Senator Reid went to the floor and tried to fix it the next day. But what is the significance of that comment, and what’s the state of the debate?

MR. MEACHAM: I think we’re in this odd moment where everyone wants to support the troops, but move away from the mission. And the Democrats are living in terror of—and I think that’s the reaction to Senator Reid’s comments—is to look as though they’re being unsupportive of the troops, because that is a—to link all these things together—that’s an American value. That’s something we should all share. We should be—in the political culture at the moment, we should be supporting the troops in the field, we should be taking care of them when we come home. That’s become a very live political question. And when the language of lives wasted, which Senator McCain said on Letterman, and had to...

MR. RUSSERT: Senator Obama.

MS. GOODWIN: Obama.

MR. MEACHAM: Senator Obama. People don’t want to hear that more than 3,000 American lives have been wasted in a war that, whatever you think about the run-up and the intelligence failures, was undertaken with Congress and with the broad support of the American people and is a grand historical bet. And it’s something that we are not going to know whether it’s worked or not worked for a long time.

MR. RUSSERT: David, is there any indication that the secretary of defense, or the secretary of state believe the war is lost?

MR. GREGORY: No. Not that they’ll certainly come out and, and say publicly. And, and they are behind a surge strategy that’s only halfway complete. But Republicans close to the White House said to me this week, “Look, we, we don’t want people to focus just on the war itself in terms of this is a referendum on the war, we’re in awful shape.” But what Harry Reid’s comments do is focus on what the alternative is from the Democrats, and it sort of distracts from how people feel about the war, and that’s where the president is trying to keep the focus, which is on concentrate on what they’re proposing and then the alternative, and is that a sound enough strategy?

MR. RUSSERT: The Democrats are going to pass legislation which says here’s the funding for the war, but here’s a date withdrawal for U.S. troops and benchmarks for the Iraqis to reach. The president will veto that.

MR. GREGORY: Right.

MR. RUSSERT: The Democrats will then send new legislation back, perhaps not with a withdrawal date, but saying to the president, “We want you to notify us, inform us on a regular basis as to whether or not the Iraqi government is performing adequately.” Will the president accept that language?

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