MTP Transcript for Nov. 19

SEN.-ELECT WEBB: OK.

(Videotape, April 28, 1985):

SEN.-ELECT WEBB: If I had one lesson that stands out in my mind, it is that you cannot fight a war and debate it at the same time.

(End videotape)

MR. RUSSERT: That’s what we’re doing right now, aren’t we?

SEN.-ELECT WEBB: In a, in a way. I mean, any time you have these, these situations that go on for a long period of time, you have to be able to, to answer questions now. And I, you know, I’m one of these people who—there, there aren’t many of us—who can still justify for you the reasons that we went into Vietnam, however screwed up the strategy got, whereas I don’t think there were legitimate reasons for us to have taken this move into Iraq, again, with the situations that come—the other situations in the region that were a lot more...

MR. RUSSERT: You opposed it publicly two years before we went in.

SEN.-ELECT WEBB: I did. And, and on strategic grounds that the—if, if you’re going to work in this region, the Arab-Israeli situation should be first order priority. We need to find Dennis Ross or, or someone of, of, of that stature to come in and, and really aggressively attempt to bring a resolution to that situation. We need to address international terrorism. We created what I was calling at the time a strategic mouse trap by going into Iraq when we did. We have to fix that, that’s the reality that we’re dealing with. But, again, the way to fix it is to work from the diplomatic into the military rather than the other way around.

MR. RUSSERT: Your son, Jimmy, 24, is a Marine in Iraq, you wore his combat boots throughout the entire campaign. Is it hard talking about this war knowing that your own son is over there?

SEN.-ELECT WEBB: I have, you know, feelings as a father that I have, you know, I have to separate from the policy issues, because there are a lot of people who have loved ones there and, you know, so I, I think in terms of policy issues I can separate that. Very difficult personally, I have to admit.

MR. RUSSERT: Jon Tester, let me show you what Major General J.D. Thurman, the senior commander of American forces in Baghdad, said. “Part of our problem is that we want this more than they do,” talking about the Iraqis.  That’s a very powerful statement.

SEN.-ELECT TESTER: Well, I mean, I—the—you know, if you go back to what, what Senator-Elect Webb said about diplomatic pressures, you know, I think that is, is just so right on the mark. It, it really is critically important that we visit with our allies to develop, to develop a plan for the region, and also keep our enemies close on this thing. Because I think it’s in everybody’s best interests to try to find some sort of resolution here. And I don’t know if it’s wanting it more than they. I think it’s, it’s knowing what we accomplish when we’re done. That, that’s part, that’s part of what is, is mysterious to me when I look at what’s going on in Iraq right now.

MR. RUSSERT: One of the things that happened the day after the election, Jim Webb, was that President Bush announced the Donald Rumsfeld was leaving; that Robert Gates was going to replace him as secretary of defense. And there’s a photograph of Mr. Gates meeting with John Warner, the chairman of the Armed Services Committee. Would you like to be able to vote on Mr. Gates’ confirmation, rather than have him confirmed before you’re sworn in?

SEN.-ELECT WEBB: I would, and that has been misinterpreted by, by some. I heard there was a column by Robert Novak saying that I have some personal animus toward Mr. Gates. I don’t even know Mr. Gates. But if this is an individual that I’m going to be working with for the next two years, I would like to be able to ask my own questions, and to examine, you know, his, his qualifications. And I, I think that’s sort of logical. If it doesn’t happen, it doesn’t happen, but certainly I would like to be able to, to sit down in his confirmation hearing and take a vote.

MR. RUSSERT: Let me turn to the issue of congressional corruption. Jon Tester, here’s a campaign ad that ran all across the state of Montana. Let’s watch, and come back and talk about it.

(Videotape, Jon Tester campaign ad):

AD ANNOUNCER: Look around Montana, and you’ll see, Jon Tester is catching on.  (Several people shown getting haircuts similar to Jon Tester) He’ll put an end to Senator Burns’ kind of corruption and make the U.S. Senate look a little more like Montana.

SEN.-ELECT TESTER: I’m Jon Tester, and I approved this message. I approve the haircut, too.

(End videotape)

MR. RUSSERT: Take away the haircut, let’s talk about corruption. You talked about Senator Burns’ kind of corruption. Right now there are proposals before the incoming U.S. Senate, senator-elect, which will talk about free meals and airplane rides, and so forth. Two of the areas that some in the Senate, some Democrats, don’t want to go near are establishing an Office of Public Integrity, and also full disclosure for the so-called “earmarks,” money that Senators target for their home states. Are you in favor of a comprehensive reform package that would include the creation of an Office of Public Integrity, and deal with earmarks?

SEN.-ELECT TESTER: I, I, I’m, I’m not—I will tell you that, that building a bureaucracy in Washington, D.C., is not something that I’m crazy about, so developing another office is something I’d take a hard look at before we did it. I do think that we need to get a hold of the earmark situation, and make sure that they’re, they’re transparent, make sure that the people who are offering the earmarks, we know who they are.

But, but really transparency in government is the key here, Tim. When you talk about influence that the K Street lobbyists have on the process, I think we can limit that. But ultimately, in the end, we—you need to have people in Washington, D.C., who are honest, who, who can’t be bought. And, and we will come up with an ethics plan, we talked to Senator Reid about that, that, that will take care of some of the, the free meals and travel and all that stuff.  I also hope that we, we get something as far as, as posting who the senators meet with, to the best of their ability. And I know that’s, that’s tough when it comes to staff in offices this size, but, but the fact is, is the people back home need to know who we’re meeting with, so that they have the opportunity to put their two bits in, in, too.

When you talk about a representative government, it should be for everybody not just the moneyed interests. And, and when we have a situation like’s been back there the last couple of years with, with—and you know the names, I don’t have to bring them up again—that, that have had the dealings with, with, with lobbyists and, and, and money transactions. I just don’t, don’t think it speaks well for public service at the local level, state level, and especially at the federal level. And we’ve got a lot of good people back there that do a lot of work, sacrificing family and a lot of other things, and we need to make sure that, that ethics and honesty is a, is a foundation quality for our government.

MR. RUSSERT: One of the issues in your campaign was Senator Burns saying, “I may have said some outrageous things, but I bring home the goods, I bring home the pork for Montana.” And Senator Harry Reid, the Democrat, said, “If you vote for Jon Tester, we’re going to put him on the Appropriations Committee as soon as possible.” That’s where the pork is, that’s where the earmarks are, but you didn’t get on that committee. What happened?

SEN.-ELECT TESTER: Well, I think that Senator Reid did the best he could do, and, and I think that—I don’t think any of the freshmen got on that committee. I hope that I will get on it as soon as possible. I’ve talked to Senator Reid about that, and I think it will happen. I’m very happy with the committees I got—I’ve, I’ve received in the Senate. And, and, you know, I’ve, I’ve been in the process in state government for eight years. I can, I can deal with, with issues of importance to Montanans through the amendment process on the floor and, and will do that.

But I think part of what will enable me to do exactly what I talked about with amendments is transparency in government. You can’t affect the process unless you know what’s transpiring on the floor at the time. So there has to be transparency and opportunity for debate.

MR. RUSSERT: So if you got on the Appropriations Committee, you would want complete transparency for that committee?

SEN.-ELECT TESTER: Absolutely. I think, I think it’s very important to be able to offer a debate. What happens—offer to—be able to debate the issue.  What happens when earmarks are done until late at night and there’s not opportunity for total transparency is you get a lot of projects funded that are truly pork projects that shouldn’t be funded, taking money away from good projects that should be.

MR. RUSSERT: I want to ask you both about the economy. Jim Webb, when you were running, you said, “I’m not just running about Iraq, I’m running about what I see happening to the economy in this country, the divisions between rich and poor, as a Jacksonian Democrat.” And let me show you an op-ed piece that you wrote on Wednesday for The Wall Street Journal, and have both you and Jon Tester talk about it.

“The most important ... issue in politics today is our society’s steady drift toward a class-based system, the likes of which we have not seen since the 19^th century. America’s top tier has grown infinitely richer and more removed over the past 25 years. It is not unfair to say that they are literally living in a different country. Few among them send their children to public schools; fewer still send their loved ones to fight our wars. They own most of our stocks. ... The top 1 percent now takes in an astounding 16 percent of national income. ...

“This ever-widening divide is too often ignored or downplayed by its beneficiaries. A sense of entitlement has set in among elites, bordering on hubris. When I raised this issue with corporate leaders during the recent political campaign, I was met repeatedly with denials and, from some, an overt lack of concern for those who are falling behind. A troubling arrogance is in the air among the nation’s most fortunate. ...

“With this new Congress ... American workers have a chance to be heard in ways that have eluded them for more than a decade. Nothing is more important for the health of our society than to grant them the validity of their concerns. And our government leaders have no greater duty than to confront the growing unfairness in this age of globalization.”

Very strong words. What do we do? Roll back tax cuts? Roll back trade agreements? What do we do?

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