Transcript for Aug. 20

SEN. McCAIN: It’s never been the right strategy as far as I’m concerned, since the beginning when I came back from my first trip to Iraq after every military person, including the British, told me that we didn’t have sufficient troops to control the situation.

MR. GREGORY: Last week on this program, I asked RNC chairman Ken Mehlman about critics who question the military plan and the strategy for Iraq at this point, and this is what he said. Watch.

(Videotape, August 13, 2006):

MR. KEN MEHLMAN: But look, we’re not coming in and saying, “Stay the course.” The choice in this election is not between stay the course and cut and run, it’s between win by adapting and cut and run.

Let me tell you what we’re doing. The fact is, before the successful Iraqi elections, the number of troops went up from 137,000 to 160,000. That’s adapting to win. Recently the increased troops in Baghdad, adapting to win.

(End videotape)

MR. GREGORY: What you call a Whack-A-Mole approach...

SEN. McCAIN: Well...

MR. GREGORY: ...Mehlman says is adapting to win. Which is it?

SEN. McCAIN: ...I think, I think what Ken is saying is correct. We are trying to address the areas where the insurgency flares up. The problem is, of course, that as I, as we’ve already discussed. But it’s...

MR. GREGORY: But that’s not, is that adapting to win? Is that a winning strategy? You said a moment ago it’s not.

SEN. McCAIN: I think that our generals on the ground are doing the best they have with what they have. And I—and the men and women who are fighting are the very, very best of us, and it’s amazing. When you meet the guardsmen who have been over there three times, our National Guard and others, it’s, it’s remarkable the great job they’re doing, but it’s very, very tough because of the lack of sufficient assets, as I mentioned.

MR. GREGORY: If more troops are needed, do you think the president’s prepared to commit more troops?

SEN. McCAIN: I do not know because I don’t know what his thinking is, but I know that the president’s committed to win and I know the president’s committed to prevail.

MR. GREGORY: But is, is it your sense that he does not share your view?

Because he said repeatedly if more troops are needed, they’ll get them.

SEN. McCAIN: Well, it’s obvious that I have not shared the administration’s view. I’ve had strong differences with Secretary Rumsfeld on this issue and other aspects of the war. The, the, the standing down of the Army, rather than hiring them. The, the failure to do a series of measures which were important as part of our effort to control Iraq.

MR. GREGORY: Mm-hmm. Do you think military commanders on the ground are asking for more troops?

SEN. McCAIN: I know that military commanders on the ground need more troops, whether they’re asking for them or not. But see, this is kind of a false argument.

MR. GREGORY: Mm-hmm.

SEN. McCAIN: It’s not up to the commanders on the ground, it’s up to the leaders who assess the entire battlefield situation to decide whether they need. I’ve known very few—General McCaffrey’s going to follow us—I’ve known very few commanders in the field who see I—say, “I need help.”

MR. GREGORY: Mm-hmm.

SEN. McCAIN: So it’s up to the assessment made in—at the Pentagon level.  And from the beginning, we didn’t have enough in the invasion, the initial invasion itself.

MR. GREGORY: But this is an important point because if, if, if, if there’s no clear commitment for more troops and a firm belief by you and others that more troops are needed, what’s standing in the way? Why aren’t military leaders asking, and is there politics involved that’s keeping troops from being deployed?

SEN. McCAIN: I, I think it’s got to do with the decisions that are made in the Pentagon. And I think that that’s the sum total of it, and the advice that the president gets from the people that are on his team. And I don’t think it’s good advice. But I know that the president’s committed to win. I know that he will do what’s necessary. Many times he has said we will do whatever is necessary and I believe him.

MR. GREGORY: Do you think Secretary Rumsfeld should keep his job?

SEN. McCAIN: That’s up to the president of the United States. The president picks his team and the president—as long as the president has confidence in him, then he’ll keep that team.

MR. GREGORY: Even at this stage of the war, you think, you still stick to that position that it’s up to the president?

SEN. McCAIN: Because elections have consequences. The president has the right to pick his team. I’ve been asked a number of times if I had confidence in Secretary Rumsfeld and the answer is no.

MR. GREGORY: But you still think he should stay in place if the president wants him.

SEN. McCAIN: I think the president should pick his team and I will support the president’s selections.

MR. GREGORY: Talking about anticipation and planning, let me show you another exchange you had earlier this month with General Peter Pace, of course, chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff. Watch.

(Videotape, August 3, 2006):

SEN. McCAIN: General Pace, you said there’s a possibility of the situation in Iraq evolving into civil war. Is that correct?

GEN. PETER PACE: I did say that, yes, sir.

SEN. McCAIN: Did you anticipate this situation a year ago?

GEN. PACE: No, sir.

(End videotape)

MR. GREGORY: Why was that an important question and what did the answer tell you?

SEN. McCAIN: Because many of us anticipated that we would have greater difficulties because of the lack of troops on the ground and the lack of the elected government in Iraq from, from being able to stand up and from the problems with the police that many of us thought that it might—that this deterioration may take place. And we expect our leaders to anticipate things in war, we really do. And so because we don’t anticipate, then you are surprised.

MR. GREGORY: Should U.S. troops remain in Iraq if they are in the middle of a civil war?

SEN. McCAIN: I think that that’s a very difficult decision because you’d have to, to decide whether we can have an effect on a civil war if it was taking place in Iraq, so I don’t know the answer. But I don’t believe we’re there yet. I believe we can prevent it. I think we can win and I think we must win.

MR. GREGORY: Let me show you what our ambassador to Iraq, Zalmay Khalilzad, said almost three months ago about the time line for Iraq, how much time the Maliki government would have. This is what he said, the USA Today reported it. “‘Iraq’s new government has three to six months,’” he said, “‘to bring more stability to the country, or it could collapse,’ the U.S. ambassador to Iraq said. Unless there is increased security ... a lessening of and containing of sectarian violence, this government will face huge challenges that might pose a problem for the viability and success of the political process.” That was back on June 1. Only three months left in your view?

SEN. McCAIN: I don’t know. He—our ambassador there is one of the really great people we have serving our country, as we did in Afghanistan, is, is more precisely aware. I know that we cannot afford a continuing deteriorating situation. That’s why we have to go after Sadr, that’s why we have to take down the Mahdi Army, because the Shiites cannot—militias cannot control Iraq.  We cannot allow that to happen.

MR. GREGORY: Do you think that Maliki is doing enough to stand up to those militias that are associated with his own political party?

SEN. McCAIN: I think he’s trying very hard. I think it’s difficult. I think he’s a good man and a good leader. I just think that the problems are very significant. And don’t ignore the influence of the Iranians in, particularly in southern Iraq. It’s very significant.

MR. GREGORY: What are they up to?

SEN. McCAIN: Well, they’ve moved in with many of their clerics into the smaller areas. They have basically taken over some of the militias. They’re providing IEDs, training, and equipment to the insurgents in southern Iraq.  They are playing a rather big role. And not just in southern Iraq, but primarily.

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